Have Your Say

Read stories in order

If you want to discuss each of Christie's stories in the order in which they were published, use this guide to direct your reading.

Marple reading order

Lil_Bit 05 Jul 11 at 2:45 a.m. GMT

I have a question about the reading order for the Marple novels. (BTW, the reading order PDFs seem to have either moved or disappeared--I can't find them anywhere. Or have I just had one martini too many?)

In the Marple reading order, They Do it with Mirrors and Pocket are placed between Bertram's and Nemesis, but they were written and published between Murder is Announced and Paddington. I'm re-reading all of them, and I'm currently on Paddington. So far I've read all the books in order of publication except for Sleeping Murder, and I've not found any reason to change the reading order any of the books. Does anyone know why Mirrors and Pocket were moved around like that?

Also, it seems to me that The Thirteen Problems should be first in the Marple reading order, seeing as the individual stories were published before Vicarage. Am I the only one who feels this way?

Login or register to add posts and reply

31 replies

Reverse order

Lil_Bit 05 Mar 12 at 8:23 p.m. GMT

Goodness, LucyE, you're certainly living up to your namesake! What a terrific sleuthing job. And no worries about the errors--even Miss Marple has had to admonish herself on occasion for what she considered "stupidity."

(On a separate note, I'm finally on Curtain. All I have left after this is to re-read Come, Tell Me How You Live and to read her Autobiography and the Westmacott novels. I'm starting to feel wistful. This has been a years-long process, and it's really been fun to work my way through her entire oeuvre. Ah, well. Perhaps I can do it again in twenty years or so.)

LucyE 05 Mar 12 at 5:01 p.m. GMT

What a shame we have only 30 minutes to delete a post. Not only did I get it wrong below (as did Anne Hart I think), but I babbled my gammon and spinach across four separate posts

Misdating Strange Jest is embarassing because I (and Hart) breezed by JM's reference to her grand-nephew Lionel.  Lionel is Raymond and Joan West's eldest son.  Given what JM says about him in the story, he's most likely between 7 and 12 years old at the time of the Strange Jest events.  Raymond is not married at the time of The Thirteen Problems.  So Lionel could not have been 7-12 years old in the late 1920's.  Rather the Strange Jest events must have happened between 1937 and 1941.

Miss Marple Tells a Story has two dating questions: when JM tells the story to the Wests and when the events of the story happened.  The former cannot be later than May 11, 1934 when AC read the story on the BBC. JM says the murder in Barnchester happened "some years" ago. but also that the elder Mr. Petherick had died only 2 years before her telling of the story. Thus Mr. Petherick could have died no later than 1932.  So when did the murder happen? JM tells us she hadn't paid much attention to it at the time, because there was a lot of excitement about the district nurse, overshadowing "outside occurrences like an earthquake in India and a murder in Barnchester." An earthquake in India, hmm? Turns out that between 1920 and May 1934, there were only two major earthquakes in India. The strongest and deadliest struck Bihar on January 15, 1934, which was recent enough to remind JM of India quakes, but was after Mr. Petherick's death. The other quake (a 7.1) hit Dhubri on July 2, 1930.  I believe this is our quake and so suggest the murder happened in the summer of 1930, Mr. Petherick died in 1932, and the story was told in 1934-- all after TMATV.

LucyE 13 Feb 12 at 4:46 p.m. GMT

Part 4

Hart doesn't explain why she places "Strange Jest" before TMATV in the Marple chronology. I think the best argument for doing so is that, because of Helier's actressy personality and dimness, the more time that passed after meeting Marple at the Bantry's, the less likely Helier would be to think of asking Marple to solve the young couple's problem.  A week, a month, even a year or so after the Bantry's party seems plausible, but with a longer period -- especially that of more than a decade -- Helier likely wouldn't remember Marple, much less invite her to a party.  It's not a strong argument, but I do think the "Strange Jest" case probably did happen close in time to TMATV, and since Hart has thought about this more than I have, I'll go along with her placing it before TMATV.

LucyE 13 Feb 12 at 4:45 p.m. GMT

Part 3

From Curran's MITM, there seems no doubt AC wrote this story in 1940-41.  In the beginning of the story, Jane Helier has invited Marple to a party so that she can introduce Marple to a young couple with a problem.  Marple first met Jane Helier at the Bantry's dinner party which forms the second six stories of TTP, so "Strange Jest" definitely comes after the first 12 of the TTP stories, but how long after is not clear.  In the TTP stories, we learn that Helier is a beautiful, talented, and famous, but somewhat dim, actress.  "Strange Jest" neither adds to or alters our view of Helier.  And, there are no other known interactions between the two Janes, before or after "Strange Jest." [cont. Part 4]

LucyE 13 Feb 12 at 4:39 p.m. GMT

Part 2

From all this, arguably, the events of "Miss Marple Tells a Story" could have happened years before TTP, making it -- like Poirot's "The Chocolate Box" -- Marple's first reported case.

The second other story Hart places after TTP but before TMATV is "Strange Jest."  The first book appearance in the US was in Three Blind Mice & Other Stories (1950 ) and in the UK again not until 1979 in Miss Marple's Final Cases.  However, it originally appeared, under the title "A Case of Buried Treasure," in a November 1941 edition of an American weekly newspaper, This Week.  [continued, see part 3]

LucyE 13 Feb 12 at 4:33 p.m. GMT

Oops, Lil_Bit, I forgot about two other stories which Anne Hart places after TTP but before TMATV in her chronology of Marple cases.

The first book publication of "Miss Marple Tells a Story" was in The Regatta Mystery & Other Stories (US 1939), but it didn't appear in any UK collection until 1979 in Miss Marple's Final Cases & Two Other Stories.  This story first print appearance was under the title "Behind Closed Doors" in the May 1935 edition of Home Journal, but it actually made its debut on May 11, 1934 with AC herself reading it on a BBC radio program.  From the text of the story, we can work back from 1934.  In telling the story to Raymond and Joan, Ms. Marple says its "about a curious little business that happened some years ago now."  The little business began with a visit from her solicitor Mr. Petherick, the elder.  She mentions that Mr. Petherick had "died two years ago," so Mr. Petherick's death, which has nothing to do with the story, can be dated no later than 1932.  Based on my experience of how older people think and speak of time, I think it unlikely Marple would have said the story happened "some time ago" if it had merely happened within, say, the preceding five years, so placing the events of the story before TMATV seems right.  But that same reasoning leads me to wonder whether the events of the story might actually have happened years before TTP.  Mr. Petherick also appears in the first six stories of TTP.  We know that he had been Marple's solicitor for many years, and of all the guests at the Tuesday night gathering, he likely had the most knowledge of Marple's unique problem-solving talents.  Indeed, in the problem he posed ("Motive vs. Opportunity), Mr. Petherick tells Sir Henry that Marple "has her own way of looking at things."

[Too many characters, so must break this post in two.]

Lil_Bit 12 Feb 12 at 7:09 p.m. GMT

Thanks for a well thought-out reply, LucyE! I forgot about "The Love Detectives." I read the non-series books before I read Marple, so the similarities didn't strike me at the time. I'll have to go back and re-read it.

LucyE 12 Feb 12 at 6:46 p.m. GMT

The publication date of a short story collection can be misleading because most stories were first published in a UK and/or US magazine before, often years or even decades before, appearing in a collection.

The Thirteen Problems collection was first published in June 1932 in the UK and, retitled The Tuesday Club Murders, in 1933 in the US.  However, as John Curran and others note, the first six stories in TTP were originally published between December 1927 and May 1928 in the Royal Magazine.  The next six stories were published between December 1929 and May 1930.  "Death by Drowning," the last of the thirteen and the only one to be first published after the October 1930 publication of Murder at the Vicarage, first appeared in the november 1931 edition of Nash's Pall Mall Magazine.

Further, Curran, Anne Hart, and the texts themselves support the view that 12 of the stories were definitely written and set before The Murder at the Vicarage.  "Death by Drowning" is the only one that might have been written after TMATV.

Another example of the collection date pitfall:  In Murder in the Making, Curran states that TMATV had its origins in "The Love Detectives," a Quin story first published, under the title "At the Crossroads," in the December 1926 edition of The Storyteller magazine.  Although written and published smack in the middle of the other Quin stories, "The Love Detectives" was not included in the 1930 collection The Mysterious Mr. Quin.  Rather the story didn't appear in any collection until 1950 in the US (Three Blind Mice & Other Stories) and 1991 in the UK (Problem at Pollensa Bay & Other Stories).  So, if one were to order stories according to collection publication date, one could wrongly assume that "The Love Detectives" was a pale reworking of TMATV rather than the interesting seed of an idea which grew into TMATV.

Tommy_A_Jones 17 Dec 11 at 2:47 p.m. GMT

I have thought of a Scenario where Sleeping Murder should be read last.

Cherry Helps Miss Marpl,e into bed and she decides to put pen to paper and explain how she once  met a Lovely young Couple at her Nephew Raymonds House and How she helped the young Girl whi had a feeling Something Distressing had Happened at the House they had just Bought.

In relation to your feelings about reading The Thirteen Problems 1st Lil-Bit wouldn't it be more usual ti have an Authors Novel With A Character and then a Book of short stories? I have always thought that short Stories come after at Least one Novel like a Snack comes between Too Big Meals, Just My Thought.

That is how Books that could have been Written Later could be read earlier.

Tommy_A_Jones 09 Sep 11 at 2:51 p.m. GMT

I am still not sure where in the order of things I should read Sleeping Murder and where can I see the Osbourne List?

GKCfan 06 Aug 11 at 6:44 a.m. GMT

Sleeping Murder was originally published in 1976.  However, it was written much earlier.  The traditional story says that Christie wrote it during WWII and locked it away to be published after her death, but Christie scholar John Curran has determined that the book was actually written (or at least revised) some time later, and then was placed in a bank vault to be published posthumously.

Dew530 06 Aug 11 at 1:38 a.m. GMT

Please tell me what was the original publishing date of "Sleeping Murder?"  Thanks for any help I can get on this question.

Lil_Bit 05 Aug 11 at 5:01 p.m. GMT

Hrm. I haven't been able to find it. I'm out of town, so I can't check to see which edition I have. I've read the first chapter, and I'm enjoying the way in which he interweaves the stories and Christie's life, but he hasn't actually mentioned reading order so far. Ah, well. I'm currently reading the Poirots in order of publication, and that seems to be working well, aside from not knowing exactly where Murder in Mesopotamia actually belongs--I know she wrote that book out of chronological order.

Number3 04 Aug 11 at 12:26 p.m. GMT

Lil the main list is in the front, but the whole book is devoted to the reading order and a good biography as well. 

I wonder if the book has been revised since I read it.

Lil_Bit 03 Aug 11 at 7:28 a.m. GMT

Number3 (or anyone else who's read Osborne), where exactly is the reading order found in Osborne's book? I've been leafing through it, and I can't seem to find it.

Tommy_A_Jones 20 Jul 11 at 2:10 p.m. GMT

Kitty is working for Miss Marple in Pocketfull of Rye she is at Miss Marple's House when She returns from Solving the Murder of Rex, Adele and Gladys, I listened to it last night, It was abridged but they Radio Versions are |More Faithful than some TV Adaptations.

I agree about the Forgotten Date being the only one mentioned in Bertram's Hotel I started listening to that last night.

I don't think anyone is disputing Murder At The Vicarage is before all other Miss Marple Novels, Anyway Thankyou |I know now when to read Sleeping Murder.

I don't remember off hand who was working for Miss Marple in The Perfect Maid

Lil_Bit 19 Jul 11 at 6:24 p.m. GMT

Oh, as for Bertram's, I don't think it necessarily takes place near Christmas. She does do some shopping, but some of it is just household goods. (She's very excited to be able to find some tea towels without fancy pictures on them, I recall.) I think she just took advantage of her trip to London to do some Christmas shopping that she wouldn't be able to do in St Mary Mead or the neighboring towns.

I also vaguely recall that she wore a light coat when going outside, and she takes tea outside at one point, so I believe it takes place in early autumn, possibly October. Canon Pennyfather's disappearance revolves around a forgotten date, but I believe the book only mentions the day of his conference (the 18th, I believe) without ever mentioning the month. If anyone recalls otherwise, please correct me.

Lil_Bit 19 Jul 11 at 6:04 p.m. GMT

I have Sleeping Murder between Moving Finger and Murder is Announced. It definitely takes place before 1953 because the current Queen is referred to as "Princess Elizabeth." (Someone has a photo of her and her sister hanging in their sitting room.) There's nothing to indicate that it doesn't come earlier, but it definitely can't come after Pocket. My feeling is that it's pre-war, though, as it doesn't have the feeling of post-war despair that you see in the later Marples.

Regarding Gladys, I agree with Mr_west; I don't think we actually see her working for Miss Marple, but I have to admit that I don't pay much attention to any of her servants except for Cherry and Miss Knight (and, of course, Faithful Florence).

As for Cherry, she never went to work for an institution. She used to live in the Development, but at the end of Mirror Crack'd, she asks Miss Marple if she and her husband can come and live in a unused room in her cottage. Cherry doesn't appear in the next two novels (Caribbean and Bertram's), but she does appear at the beginning of Nemesis.

Mr_west 19 Jul 11 at 3:05 p.m. GMT

Tommy, I think Sleeping Murder should be read after The Murder At The Vicarage. The only reason I'm saying that is Vicar's son. He was born in the Murder At The Vicarage right? and in the Body in the Library he is a little child, and in The Mirror Crack'd From Side To Side he is an adult and in Sleeping Murder it's mention that he is still a little child, so I conclude Sleeping Murder actualy happened after the murder at the vicarage and the book that follow The Body In The Library (I don't remember which novel was that).

I don't think Gladys worked for Miss Marple in any of the novels, Miss Marple just mention that as a fact in A Pocket Full Of Rye and in the short story Sanctury (when she met her in London)

Tommy_A_Jones 19 Jul 11 at 1:09 p.m. GMT

I don't really have an answer apart from to ask if I am right in asking if I am right in thinking Cherry is works for Miss Marple when Miss Marple goes to the establishment where Cherry went to work at? I can't actually remember which stories have Gladys working for Miss Marple but I know there is at least 1.

I might be wrong but Does At Bertram's Hotel take place near Christmas? I get the feeling she buys Presents aswell as Sheets and Bed linen while in London.

One more thing, Sleeping Murder is written in the 40s but Published in the 70s but as I am re-reading the Agatha Christie Books in order where should I place Sleeping Murder I want to read them in the order they should be read not the order of Publication.