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Biggest Star in a Minor Role

Aurora 18 Oct 08 at 10:17 a.m. GMT

Over many years I have found that even if you don't know the story you can guess whodunnit in adaptations by applying the "biggest star in a minor role" technique.

All you need to do is look at the cast list and watch for a short time to judge the biggest star's air time and you can guess the ending.

It's not foolproof but works 90% of the time in my experience. It certainly worked with the new Appointment With Death and Nemesis. Well done to Midsomer Murders who had Joss Ackland (usually absolute proof the technique works) as the victim. That really threw me.

I think directors and those responsible for casting should be more imaginative and it would make trying to guess TV/film whodunnits more enjoyable.

Any thoughts or good exceptions to the rule?

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20 replies

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Tommy_A_Jones 08 Jan 09 at 3:54 p.m. GMT

I thought they set Murder With Mirrors to Modern day as Leo McKern as the Detective mentions Lady Di.

Santonix 07 Dec 08 at 10:12 p.m. GMT

she would've made a great Mrs. Boynton, now that I think about it. though i loved her in Death on the Nile. "The roasting afternoon sun will do wonders for those jaundiced jowls of hers." priceless.

squatty 07 Dec 08 at 11:34 a.m. GMT

Thanks for clearing that up Santonix. I totally agree that she was one feisty lady. I would love to have seen her play one of AC's more juicy villans earlier in her career. I thought she was rather wasted in Death On The Nile and was obviously very ill and too fragile in Murder With Mirrors

Santonix 07 Dec 08 at 5:31 a.m. GMT

squatty

Oh dear - Bette Davis in Murder With Mirrors was terribly sad. She must have been a few months from death and it really showed. I dont think it was ever specified in the Helen Hayes's Marples where she came from. It was always presented as some Transatlantic village somewhere. But I think that in all those 1980s TV movies, none of the American cast members ever attempted a British accent.

Four years from death, actually. She was quite a feisty lady

squatty 04 Dec 08 at 7:18 p.m. GMT

Oh dear - Bette Davis in Murder With Mirrors was terribly sad. She must have been a few months from death and it really showed. I dont think it was ever specified in the Helen Hayes's Marples where she came from. It was always presented as some Transatlantic village somewhere. But I think that in all those 1980s TV movies, none of the American cast members ever attempted a British accent.

Marc_Anton 04 Dec 08 at 2:27 p.m. GMT

Perhaps this was just Helen Hayes' stage accent, after all she played Queen Victoria on Broadway. I never got any indication seeing these 80's series that Hayes played an American version of Miss Marple, I just thought she didn't get the accent right. I found Murder with Mirrors very depressing, it looked cheap and Bette Davis.... well, very sad. A Caribbean Mystery reminded me of an episode of The Love Boat (without the ship). Nice to see you Pghfan, it has been a long time.

pghfan 04 Dec 08 at 1:55 p.m. GMT

Good question. I don't think Ms Hayes ever atempted a British accent in her Miss Marple roles. I think we were all just expected to overlook that. Marc (good you see you back as well!), I expect that she may have been in England for something else and somehow managed to find the time to film those short few scenes in Murder is Easy. It would seem odd to bring her over just for that.

GKCfan 03 Dec 08 at 9:19 p.m. GMT

Was Helen Hayes's interpretation of Miss Marple even supposed to be British? I haven't seen "Murder With Mirrors" or "A Caribbean Mystery" in a long time, but I think that in "Murder With Mirrors" there are some indications that Hayes's Marple was American (according to some discussions with Bette Davis's Carrie Serrocold), and just on an extended visit to England.

Marc_Anton 03 Dec 08 at 1:47 p.m. GMT

Helen Hayes was indeed a bit wasted in Murder is Easy; she had about one scene and was then bumped off after a minute or ten (but to be honest, that was all of Miss Pinkerton’s role in the book also). Did they bring her from the US just to film that little scene? The rest was filmed in Britain. Weren't there some other veteran English actresses around? I never found Hayes’ accent very convincing. And yes, it is available outside the USA; I have the DVD-box with all the Christies from that period. Murder is Easy is actually the best of the bunch, it has more atmosphere and the rest of the cast is rather good. Of all those Christies from the 1980s, this one looks the least dated.

pghfan 02 Dec 08 at 9:35 p.m. GMT

No one has mentioned what I think is the shortest part by a big star in a Christie adaptation: Two-time OSCAR winner Helen Hayes had a tiny role in the (awful) US TV movie of Murder is Easy, shot in the 1980's, I believe. I am not sure whether this is available outside of the US, though.

GKCfan 28 Nov 08 at 7:20 p.m. GMT

Dear garfreek, If you will please be kind enough to read the posts again, you will see that I did not spoil "Peril at End House." Another poster made the comments that may have spoiled the ending. I have reported them as a spoiler. I try very hard to avoid spoilers, and when I do reveal the ending, I try to make sure that I post a "contains spoilers" sign. I regret that your enjoyment of "Peril at End House" was spoiled, but that was not my doing. Sincerely, GKCfan

garfreek 28 Nov 08 at 5:01 p.m. GMT

thanks gkc fan, you just spoiled peril at end house for me! put a warning please i looked forward to reading that one!,

Aurora 08 Nov 08 at 5:06 p.m. GMT

Marc Anton & Santonix - I agree with you both! I think the differential is quality and class. The ones we really remember are ones that break the rule. Maybe the people responsible for casting should listen to this message?

Santonix 08 Nov 08 at 9:41 a.m. GMT

This rule seems to be broken most often when an actor has done a Bond film. Likely as not, they'll be the victim! The only exceptions, I think, are Sean Connery in Murder on the Orient Express, Shirley Eaton in Ten Little Indians (60s) and Joanna Lumley in Marple: The Body in the Library.

I refer, of course, to Diana Rigg in Evil Under the Sun, Gert Frobe and Adolfo Celi in And Then There Were None (70s), Timothy Dalton in Marple: The Sittaford Mystery, Jane Seymour in Marple: Ordeal by Innocence, Lois Chiles in Death on the Nile, Britt Ekland in Endless Night.....the list goes on!

Marc_Anton 21 Oct 08 at 4:47 a.m. GMT

Remember that the Hickson Marples and the 'old' Poirots (up to Murder in Mesopotamia) hardly had any 'stars' at all, not even really big names. Only very reliable ensemble actors. The new Marples and the last 12 Poirots have some well known names (Joanna Lumley, Elliot Gould, Timothy Dalton, Derek Jacoby) but hardly what you call stars. Because of this the cast is sometimes a bit unbalanced because the 'names' have a tendency to show off and overact to live up to their reputation, especially when they are not cast as the murderer. Most often the murderer is someone who underplays the part and you hardly notice (acting wise) them: After the Funeral, Sleeping Murder, Third Girl. This has to do with how the character was originally created in the novel, but also with the fact that 90 minutes is hardly enough to flesh out all the characters, create atmosphere AND a believable plot line. Sigh....it is a hard job to make it perfect and please everybody, I know!

By the way, how do you create empty lines in the postings , is it only possible when you start a new thread? I normally write in paragraphs and use 'white lines' in my posts but when they are published on the website, they appear as one big text block.

As you can see, I found out by now. You have to create paragraphs with the edit-function AFTER you published you post. There is no other way (I guess?)

GKCfan 21 Oct 08 at 2:56 a.m. GMT

This reply contains spoiler information. Show reply

I was thinking– we're talking about big stars in minor roles turning out to be the killer... If you didn't know the ending of the Lumet/Finney version of "Murder on the Orient Express" you'd think this rule didn't apply, but once you know the solution, boy does it ever work! It doesn't really work for the all-star versions of "Evil Under the Sun" or "Death on the Nile," though.

Marc_Anton 20 Oct 08 at 7:11 p.m. GMT

Yes, but that is about how Christie uses her writing skils and plotting technique in her novels. This topic is about having certain actors performing certain roles in the various film and TV versions of those books. Let's not mix novels and film versions in our discussions, they are two different wolds; wonderful to discuss in depth but preferably in different folders.

squatty 20 Oct 08 at 5:08 p.m. GMT

Another foolproof way of spotting the murderer is to focus your attention on any character who has been shot at but has survived. Death On The Nile, Peril At End House and A Murder Is Announced are all examples of this rule applying.

Marc_Anton 20 Oct 08 at 7:44 a.m. GMT

It doesn't always work but I can understand when you have a really interesting killer and a very complex motive, you need a very good actor/actress who can pull it of. It is the kind of performance when it is all over, you want it to see again and check if it was already 'all there' in the performance and you missed it because you were not really born to be a sleuth yourself. I hate it when the murderer is revealed and absolutely nothing in his/her acting performance indicated that there were evil actions behind the friendly facade. Of course a good murderer has a lot to hide but it is the fun of a dramatisation to spot the cracks in that mask of virtue. After all they are caught in the end, since he or she couldn't fool Poirot or Marple, so we like to get in too. It worked well in the two different adaptations of 'A Murder is Announced', less so in the TV-version of Towards Zero (the murderer was quite underwhelming).

GKCfan 20 Oct 08 at 4:01 a.m. GMT

Yeah, the "biggest star" rule is a pretty reliable guide– the confession scenes are often the juiciest roles for actors, so that's a pretty fair guide on a weekly series, although there are too many exceptions to count. This doesn't apply to a lot of Christie movies, though, what with the all-star casts and all. The Columbo series managed to avoid this problem, because even though the big guest star was always the killer, you knew who did it right away, so no spoiled surprises!